"Premium Pipe Tobacco"

[Law]

Greetings people!

I recently have been thinking on why shouldn't pipe tobacco companies push for a new definition to its products similar to the cigar companies pushing theirs as "premium cigars " instead of being labeled and chugged to cigarettes and other tobacco form.

I know that cigarette companies have been using the "pipe tobacco" label to sell their cigaret RYO tobacco to reduce taxes, but I do believe if companies have a plan to establish such definition, and actively working on it, it would make pipe tobacco's future more secure and possibly have a stronger fight against those taxes and legislations that could come in the future and hurt the hobby. I mean, recently cigar companies have been winning battles against the FDA in court using the their definition. in addition, studies have been coming out in support of "premium cigars" and those studies are only aiding the battle against the FDA.

I could see pipe tobacco surviving as a connoisseur choice of tobacco, similar to wine and such.

I know pipe tobacco isn't as well known or famous form of smoking and I know that they aren't close in terms of revenue of those big cigar companies, but why couldn't it be an possibility to produce a specific definition on what is premium tobacco or not?

Is it more plausible that pipe tobacco will cease rather than have a chance to fight similarly to the cigar companies?

Any opinion on this topic would enlighten the seeker.

 

[anotherbob]

what might make the difference you're looking for is us pipe smokers being visible and showing the premium nature of pipe smoking.

 

[Chasing Embers]

Probably too interlinked with the same tobacco sales. If cigarettes disappeared, the sales of Virginia, burley, and perique would plummet. Same with chewing tobacco, if it goes, there goes a big chunk of the dark fired Kentucky market.

 

[solideogloria86]

what might make the difference you're looking for is us pipe smokers being visible and showing the premium nature of pipe smoking.

It also would help if premium pipe tobacco was a billion dollar global market and could afford whole villages of high caliber attorneys to take on the FDA.

 

[Chasing Embers]

Premium is such a loaded word. Ten years ago Mac Baren 100g tins sold for $12 and smokers scoffed at them for poor quality. About six years ago they doubled their prices literally overnight and suddenly they gained popularity.

 

[Law]

Probably too interlinked with the same tobacco sales. If cigarettes disappeared, the sales of Virginia, burley, and perique would plummet. Same with chewing tobacco, if it goes, there goes a big chunk of the dark fired Kentucky market.

That may be true, but the tobacco's itself won't disappear if there is a business for it. Pipe tobacco could destinguish itself and protect itself using what the cigar companies are doing. Of course, pipes have their own problems in terms of defining what is a "premium pipe tobacco" and such. But, one right step is never a wrong one.

 

[Law]

Premium is such a loaded word. Ten years ago Mac Baren 100g tins sold for $12 and smokers scoffed at them for poor quality. About six years ago they doubled their prices literally overnight and suddenly they gained popularity.

Premium may be loaded, but in a worded definition for the FDA to extract what is considered "premium" out of pipe tobacco, it could lead into dissecting pipes from other tobacco's. That is always is a good start.

 

[Law]

It also would help if premium pipe tobacco was a billion dollar global market and could afford whole villages of high caliber attorneys to take on the FDA.

And that... I could see pipe tobacco companies waiting for the big cigar companies to win their early & gruesome battles against the FDA, and then one day they swoop in to enter the race with a well established path labeling themselves also similar to cigars in terms of "puffing" and not inhaling, no contact with the tobacco leaf via the lips, etc.

 

[mso489]

I don't put much store by companies telling me their blends are premium. Give me a blend and let me be the judge. Some bag tobacco is excellent in taste and burning characteristics, and some blends sold in premium packaging is just so-so and may need grating or other special handling to burn well. Occasionally this is entirely worth it, like McC's Dark Star, but often it's not. So don't be led by the tin, the tin art, or the pitch. Consider each blend on its merits, whether it's bulk, pouch, tin, or tub. Be your own man or woman on this.

 

[mortonbriar]

From what I understand, pipe tobacco just does not really have a voice in the tobacco industry...it's just a reality of %'s. When the industry folds for the big players that will be the end for the pipe tobacco manufacturers too....I think.

 

[fireground_piper]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't "premium" cigars defined by the fact that they are hand rolled vs. machine rolled gas station cigars? That is a manufacture process difference that's easy to delineate.

It could be a hard sell to come up with that definition at least for ribbon/shag cut pipe tobacco. It's probably an easier case for flake/plug/rope as it's an easy visual difference to the regulating authority who likely cares less about nuance and only that all loose cut tobacco is the same.

 

[Law]

From what I understand, pipe tobacco just does not really have a voice in the tobacco industry...it's just a reality of %'s. When the industry folds for the big players that will be the end for the pipe tobacco manufacturers too....I think.

To me that is strange. I understand pipe tobacco is no where near as big as cigarette companies, but it still has its customers and I believe it is surging in popularity. I don't believe we are going ever reach the growth of pipe smoking to its heyday, but it is growing into a speciality, luxury, tobacco enthusiast type of product where fine wines and good tobacco's stand edge to edge. I think that will be the future for pipe tobacco, and there is a future. will that be possible to maintain? I think so. Why lump the big players when, if needed, we can maintain ourselves as long as there is revenue in it and people willing to do it? I may be missing something here, in which I would let you chime in, or anyone else for that matter.

 

[Chasing Embers]

That may be true, but the tobacco's itself won't disappear if there is a business for it. Pipe tobacco could destinguish itself and protect itself using what the cigar companies are doing. Of course, pipes have their own problems in terms of defining what is a "premium pipe tobacco" and such. But, one right step is never a wrong one.

Doubtful, too niche. With the push to get flavored tobacco off of the market, it would effectively kill the pipe tobacco industry. Ninety percent if pipe tobacco sold are aromatic blends. With those gone, there wouldn't be enough sales to support the market.

 

[Law]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't "premium" cigars defined by the fact that they are hand rolled vs. machine rolled gas station cigars? That is a manufacture process difference that's easy to delineate.

It could be a hard sell to come up with that definition at least for ribbon/shag cut pipe tobacco. It's probably an easier case for flake/plug/rope as it's an easy visual difference to the regulating authority who likely cares less about nuance and only that all loose cut tobacco is the same.

It is one of the points in defining premium cigars , there is a couple more such as the lengths and exact weight ranges, prices, and more detailed estimates. I think pipe tobacco could be deconstructed as in need of moisture and humidity, presented in 3 types of cuts, ribbon, flake, and loose cut, price ranges between per pounds, and more. I really think we could do something here. It is not as hard as you might think.

 

[Chasing Embers]

To me that is strange. I understand pipe tobacco is no where near as big as cigarette companies, but it still has its customers and I believe it is surging in popularity. I don't believe we are going ever reach the growth of pipe smoking to its heyday, but it is growing into a speciality, luxury, tobacco enthusiast type of product where fine wines and good tobacco's stand edge to edge. I think that will be the future for pipe tobacco, and there is a future. will that be possible to maintain? I think so. Why lump the big players when, if needed, we can maintain ourselves as long as there is revenue in it and people willing to do it? I may be missing something here, in which I would let you chime in, or anyone else for that matter.

Right now, Chinese purchases are the largest revenue keeping the tobacco market, especially pipe tobacco afloat. It's a mark of status.

 

[Law]

Doubtful, too niche. With the push to get flavored tobacco off of the market, it would effectively kill the pipe tobacco industry. Ninety percent if pipe tobacco sold are aromatic blends. With those gone, there wouldn't be enough sales to support the market.

I see, and I would take your word for that percentage. But I see it the way I see cigars. If cigars can survive without it being flavored, then why can't pipe tobacco. I am not ignoring the differences those 2 products convey to the masses. But there is always a way. I would also be astonished how no pipe tobacco company are panicking because of those legislations to ban flavored tobacco. Are they just waiting for doomsday and not finding their way out of it? There has to be something they know that we don't.

 

[Chasing Embers]

I see, and I would take your word for that percentage.

You don't have to. Blenders Russ Ouellette and Greg Pease have both said it on this forum.

 

[Chasing Embers]

If cigars can survive without it being flavored, then why can't pipe tobacco.

Bigger market and supported by high profile smokers.

 

[Law]

Bigger market and supported by high profile smokers.

And that is the potential rather than the current situation. Undoubtedly cigars are supported way more. I see the same essence of pipe tobacco in cigars. For it to survive won’t need to be all too different. I think the main difference is how cigars appeal more to people due to the advertising it got through movies and high profile people smoking them, plus their ease of use.

 

[Chasing Embers]

plus their ease of use.

That'll be the death knell of pipe smoking though I've never considered it more difficult than any other smoking.